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	<title>Comments on: A Couple of Gems</title>
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	<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/#utm_source=feed&amp;utm_medium=feed&amp;utm_campaign=feed</link>
	<description>Analysing the Global Debt Bubble</description>
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		<title>By: Bullturnedbear</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6731</link>
		<dc:creator>Bullturnedbear</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 07:11:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6731</guid>
		<description>Hi Prudent and Icon,

You guys have been going for it.

The thing I love about you Prudent is that you just don&#039;t quit. A very admirable quality.

I do agree with Icon, I think your analysis is shallow. You are ignoring debt levels, risk aversion/sentiment changes and deleveraging/debt deflation and wealth destruction.

What concerns me greatly, is that I don&#039;t think you are reading and accepting what Steve and the other bloggers on this site (and other bearish sites like Mish) are saying. I don&#039;t understand why you bother reading this site. You do not seem to accept any of the theories proposed.

You may well be right, time will tell. Certainly to date there is no leading indicators or recent historical data to support you predictions. 

My fear is that you have taken huge bullish positions based on your predictions. I try to trade just like that. That is, predicting the future as opposed to following the herd. Well in theory anyway!

Please take care. The Macro economy and sentiment measures are crashing. These are leading indicators for falling demand. These do not support a quick turn around. 

Despite this, I do expect a large multi month relief rally in equities and commodities during 2009. But I expect it to be all bad, very bad by the end of 2009. Anyway, what do I know?

Please be cautious as the bears are ruling and that trend has not changed yet. Despite what CNBC and all the &quot;hope it will improve soon&quot; crew says.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Prudent and Icon,</p>
<p>You guys have been going for it.</p>
<p>The thing I love about you Prudent is that you just don&#8217;t quit. A very admirable quality.</p>
<p>I do agree with Icon, I think your analysis is shallow. You are ignoring debt levels, risk aversion/sentiment changes and deleveraging/debt deflation and wealth destruction.</p>
<p>What concerns me greatly, is that I don&#8217;t think you are reading and accepting what Steve and the other bloggers on this site (and other bearish sites like Mish) are saying. I don&#8217;t understand why you bother reading this site. You do not seem to accept any of the theories proposed.</p>
<p>You may well be right, time will tell. Certainly to date there is no leading indicators or recent historical data to support you predictions. </p>
<p>My fear is that you have taken huge bullish positions based on your predictions. I try to trade just like that. That is, predicting the future as opposed to following the herd. Well in theory anyway!</p>
<p>Please take care. The Macro economy and sentiment measures are crashing. These are leading indicators for falling demand. These do not support a quick turn around. </p>
<p>Despite this, I do expect a large multi month relief rally in equities and commodities during 2009. But I expect it to be all bad, very bad by the end of 2009. Anyway, what do I know?</p>
<p>Please be cautious as the bears are ruling and that trend has not changed yet. Despite what CNBC and all the &#8220;hope it will improve soon&#8221; crew says.</p>
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		<title>By: iconoclast</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6730</link>
		<dc:creator>iconoclast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 04:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6730</guid>
		<description>prudentsaver, 

they will of course steralise those purchases.

This whole game is going to be played out in the forex market, with readjustments in some currencies but not others that are fixated on pegging to the U.S. 

It may all end up in trade tensions and resolved under the WTO, on the other hand the Black Swan always likes to show itself during these times, and it could all turn very nasty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>prudentsaver, </p>
<p>they will of course steralise those purchases.</p>
<p>This whole game is going to be played out in the forex market, with readjustments in some currencies but not others that are fixated on pegging to the U.S. </p>
<p>It may all end up in trade tensions and resolved under the WTO, on the other hand the Black Swan always likes to show itself during these times, and it could all turn very nasty.</p>
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		<title>By: prudentsaver</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6729</link>
		<dc:creator>prudentsaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 03:47:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6729</guid>
		<description>If that happens, then I think the dollar will enter free fall, the only remedy for that will be for the fed to increase interest rates like crazy. I think it&#039;s similar to the asian crisis, only it&#039;s kind of reverse, the devenloping world having borrowed to the devenloped, hence, the devenloped are ending up with hiking interest rates, and crashing currencies ,to desperately attract buyers, from the devenloping world.

http://www.economist.com/finance/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11402856</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If that happens, then I think the dollar will enter free fall, the only remedy for that will be for the fed to increase interest rates like crazy. I think it&#8217;s similar to the asian crisis, only it&#8217;s kind of reverse, the devenloping world having borrowed to the devenloped, hence, the devenloped are ending up with hiking interest rates, and crashing currencies ,to desperately attract buyers, from the devenloping world.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.economist.com/finance/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11402856" rel="nofollow">http://www.economist.com/finance/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11402856</a></p>
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		<title>By: iconoclast</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6727</link>
		<dc:creator>iconoclast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 01:29:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6727</guid>
		<description>prudentsaver, you suggest there will be a vacuum, because there will be no buyers, well there will be a buyer, the Fed. The buyer of last resort if necessary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>prudentsaver, you suggest there will be a vacuum, because there will be no buyers, well there will be a buyer, the Fed. The buyer of last resort if necessary.</p>
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		<title>By: iconoclast</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6726</link>
		<dc:creator>iconoclast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:58:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6726</guid>
		<description>ned,

the Fed has purchased MBS, CMBS, high quality commercial paper, major stakes in the recapitalised banking and insurance industry all with significant haircuts, which are also earning them money as well. 

The toxic junk is already written off, the tax payer will cop that fair and square between the eyes!

Anyone who suggests that ballooning  of the Feds. balance sheet represent inflationary pressure or the Fed monetising the deficit simply doesn&#039;t know what they&#039;re talking about. Banks are sitting on the reserves, not withdrawing them as cash. When markets settle down, the Fed can and will absorb those reserves back in with sterilising sales of Treasury securities, just as it did in 2001 or after the more modest spike in August 2007. 

Providing new reserves aggressively is absolutely and unquestionably the way the Fed needs to respond to this kind of development.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ned,</p>
<p>the Fed has purchased MBS, CMBS, high quality commercial paper, major stakes in the recapitalised banking and insurance industry all with significant haircuts, which are also earning them money as well. </p>
<p>The toxic junk is already written off, the tax payer will cop that fair and square between the eyes!</p>
<p>Anyone who suggests that ballooning  of the Feds. balance sheet represent inflationary pressure or the Fed monetising the deficit simply doesn&#8217;t know what they&#8217;re talking about. Banks are sitting on the reserves, not withdrawing them as cash. When markets settle down, the Fed can and will absorb those reserves back in with sterilising sales of Treasury securities, just as it did in 2001 or after the more modest spike in August 2007. </p>
<p>Providing new reserves aggressively is absolutely and unquestionably the way the Fed needs to respond to this kind of development.</p>
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		<title>By: prudentsaver</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6725</link>
		<dc:creator>prudentsaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6725</guid>
		<description>I think China&#039;s economy is the second largest economy in the world. If you measure it properly.
I don&#039;t think it&#039;s as far away. If it ends with them as with japan in 1989, (I think china now is like japan in 1975), or if they achieve world dominance remains to be seen.

ned, my take on that matter is that the fed only needs to worry about those assets after the economy recover, and then value will recover to the toxic waste to, perhaps, but not likely making them a profit after adjusting for inflation, it will then help them take money out of the economy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think China&#8217;s economy is the second largest economy in the world. If you measure it properly.<br />
I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s as far away. If it ends with them as with japan in 1989, (I think china now is like japan in 1975), or if they achieve world dominance remains to be seen.</p>
<p>ned, my take on that matter is that the fed only needs to worry about those assets after the economy recover, and then value will recover to the toxic waste to, perhaps, but not likely making them a profit after adjusting for inflation, it will then help them take money out of the economy.</p>
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		<title>By: iconoclast</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6724</link>
		<dc:creator>iconoclast</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:36:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6724</guid>
		<description>prudentsaver,

China has the potential to take up the role of a the world hegemon in the future, no doubt about that. However, they are not there in the here and now, and there are many things that can go wrong with the CPC plans. What matters is what is happening now, not may happen in twenty years time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>prudentsaver,</p>
<p>China has the potential to take up the role of a the world hegemon in the future, no doubt about that. However, they are not there in the here and now, and there are many things that can go wrong with the CPC plans. What matters is what is happening now, not may happen in twenty years time.</p>
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		<title>By: ned</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6723</link>
		<dc:creator>ned</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:33:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6723</guid>
		<description>Hi iconoclast, I am curious about the assets you say the Fed can sell to sterilise the Treasuries they buy?? What will the get for the toxic waste CDO&#039;s, Fanny and Freddie debt and AIG shares that are on their balance sheet?? I have a feeling that there will be as much interest in those &quot;assets&quot; as there was when the Fed overpaid for them, zero.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi iconoclast, I am curious about the assets you say the Fed can sell to sterilise the Treasuries they buy?? What will the get for the toxic waste CDO&#8217;s, Fanny and Freddie debt and AIG shares that are on their balance sheet?? I have a feeling that there will be as much interest in those &#8220;assets&#8221; as there was when the Fed overpaid for them, zero.</p>
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		<title>By: prudentsaver</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6722</link>
		<dc:creator>prudentsaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:28:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6722</guid>
		<description>iconoclast 

I think this is somehow interesting:

http://vixandmore.blogspot.com/2008/12/double-tops-in-vix.html

I think we are in something that mirrors 1998, and are on the way out. There was a huge problem with inflation earlier this year. In my book, inflation ends when interest rates are raised.  That have not happened yet, so I assume that bonds will sell off like in 99, and will flow into something, that will cause a bubble, I just don&#039;t know what yet. That will cause interest rates to go up, and then the inflation we did see in june will be killed in the traditional fashion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>iconoclast </p>
<p>I think this is somehow interesting:</p>
<p><a href="http://vixandmore.blogspot.com/2008/12/double-tops-in-vix.html" rel="nofollow">http://vixandmore.blogspot.com/2008/12/double-tops-in-vix.html</a></p>
<p>I think we are in something that mirrors 1998, and are on the way out. There was a huge problem with inflation earlier this year. In my book, inflation ends when interest rates are raised.  That have not happened yet, so I assume that bonds will sell off like in 99, and will flow into something, that will cause a bubble, I just don&#8217;t know what yet. That will cause interest rates to go up, and then the inflation we did see in june will be killed in the traditional fashion.</p>
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		<title>By: prudentsaver</title>
		<link>http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2009/01/04/a-couple-of-gems/comment-page-3/#comment-6721</link>
		<dc:creator>prudentsaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 00:23:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/?p=746#comment-6721</guid>
		<description>The point is that if they buyers are not there, the price will crash, and then there will be a vacuum, my guess is that currencies that the renminbi will be floated and fixed to gold in a moment like that, the Yen also acts as a reserve currency above the dollar, the moves in the currency markets clearly show the Yen is a emperor to the dollar. The Yuan is not a currency that&#039;s a joke like the dollar. However. Fantasies, aside. I think the stag deflation of Roubini is interesting. It&#039;s a remote possibility, that we will fall into something like japan, where the whole devenloped world experience a combination of domestic deflation and imported inflation from the BRIC countries. In that sense, the lack of union power from the seventies, ,etc, will cause us to avoid the wage price spiral, that will take hold in the emerging world, in reality causing a complete reversal of the trends of globalisation. Where food, gas, the things that matters will creep up very bad, and the things that don&#039;t matters to most, the price of services, goes down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The point is that if they buyers are not there, the price will crash, and then there will be a vacuum, my guess is that currencies that the renminbi will be floated and fixed to gold in a moment like that, the Yen also acts as a reserve currency above the dollar, the moves in the currency markets clearly show the Yen is a emperor to the dollar. The Yuan is not a currency that&#8217;s a joke like the dollar. However. Fantasies, aside. I think the stag deflation of Roubini is interesting. It&#8217;s a remote possibility, that we will fall into something like japan, where the whole devenloped world experience a combination of domestic deflation and imported inflation from the BRIC countries. In that sense, the lack of union power from the seventies, ,etc, will cause us to avoid the wage price spiral, that will take hold in the emerging world, in reality causing a complete reversal of the trends of globalisation. Where food, gas, the things that matters will creep up very bad, and the things that don&#8217;t matters to most, the price of services, goes down.</p>
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